It's been a while, and I can honestly say I do miss this space. The conversations Sarah and I brought you were not only deeply rewarding to share, they enriched and stretched me, too, inviting in deeper layers of care and wisdom for my own grief journey.

We know we released this space, hoping it would continue to thrive in the tending of other hands. And that is still a dream, even if held a little more loosely now. In the meantime, we hope you are feeling companioned by the many episodes that still live here, from Sarah's solo days with the podcasts to her guest host series to when I joined as co-host.

I'm also excited to extend an invitation to join me and grief therapist Amy Hyun Swart for a three-day grief retreat surrounded by the redwoods in the beautiful Santa Cruz Mountains in California.

I know many of you listeners are in the Bay Area and some of you connected live with Sarah when she lived there. And It would be such an honor to share some time and space with you in-person.

If you're feeling overwhelmed by the weight of the world and living through these times in our country, if the ways you've strategized to cope with your own personal sorrows are no longer serving you, if you feel alone in your grief or wish you were more resourced, this retreat offers a soft place to land.

We will gather from Sept. 5-7 for three days of sacred grief tending and ritual at the historic Ben Lomond Quaker Center .

Our time together will include guided meditations, somatic practices to connect to the wisdom of the body, ritual to engage and express our sorrows and creative offerings to learn how to carry our grief with care, patience and trust in its medicine, rather than ignoring, or being obliterated by, it. There will also be time to savor our serene surroundings while being nourished by delicious plant-based foods.

All griefs are welcome, from the personal to the national and global. You don’t have to carry it all alone. And as wise elder and ancestor Sobonfu Somé reminded us:

"Communal grieving offers something that we cannot get when we grieve by ourselves. Through validation, acknowledgement and witnessing, communal grieving allows us to experience a level of healing that is deeply and profoundly freeing."

I would love to share this healing space with you.

Find all details and registration here.

Hi! Guest host Julia Mark here.

In this third (and final!) installment of the Doors to Grief miniseries, we’ll hear from the artist, curator, educator, and death doula Brianna Hernández. It was a joy to talk with Brianna about her journey, and what motivated her to create art around grief and dying.

While our society often frames death in a dreary light, Brianna’s installations are vibrant, thought-provoking, and deeply intentional. Through her many roles, she encourages people to ask questions about death and dying, reminding us of the agency we have in planning for life’s inevitable close.

During this episode, I ask Brianna specifically about two of her installations. You can view photos of those exhibits here:

• Útiles Curativos (Brianna’s exhibit about caregiving)

• Aquí Descansamos (Brianna’s exhibit about alternate memorials/green burial)

I hope you enjoy learning about the creative doors to grief that Brianna Hernández has opened through her work!

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About Brianna Hernández

Brianna L. Hernández (b. 1991) is a Chicana artist, curator, educator, and death doula guided by socially engaged practices. In the studio, she creates multi-media installations focused on end-of-life care, grief, and mourning rituals based on lived experience, cultural research, and collaborations with peers.

In developing as an artist Brianna credits her late mother, Sylvia D. Hernández, as her most significant mentor and inspiration for the creativity, resilience, and compassion she demonstrated throughout her life.

Hernández has participated in residencies at MacDowell, The Watermill Center, Santa Fe Art Institute, The Constance Saltonstall Foundation for the Arts, SPACES, and Farwell House. She proudly serves as Director of Curation and Board Secretary of Ma’s House & BIPOC Art Studio on the Shinnecock Indian Reservation. Additionally, she is the Board Treasurer at Walker’s Point Center for the Arts, and Committee Member for the Gente Chicana/SOYmos Chicanos Arts Fund of the Greater Milwaukee Foundation.

Brianna's website
Brianna’s Instagram

Mentioned in this episode

• Útiles Curativos (Brianna’s exhibit about caregiving)

• Aquí Descansamos (Brianna’s exhibit about alternate memorials/green burial)

• Día de los Muertos

• Going With Grace death doula training

• Luna Peak Publishing (books supporting cancer and grief communities)

• Trends in obituary publishing

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Connect with us on social media: Instagram

“Your body already knows how to ride the waves. I think we’ve gotten so used to only trusting our minds and not trusting our bodies to do what’s good for them, and I think our body has a deep knowing.”

~ Erin Collins

Hi! Guest host Julia Mark here.

In this second episode of the Doors to Grief miniseries, we hear from the insightful Erin Collins about her journey to becoming a breathwork guide and sound healer.

Erin Collins offers both a scientific and spiritual perspective on how breathwork can be used as a tool for releasing stuck emotions. Our personal stories about navigating grief are woven throughout.

Whether you’re a breathwork enthusiast or wondering (like Erin’s grandfather), “Now, why would you need to teach someone how to breathe??” I hope this episode opens new doors for you.

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About Erin Collins

Erin is a breathwork meditation guide on Vashon Island near Seattle, WA. Through years of training in mental health and certification as a breathwork guide, Erin comes alongside you to provide loving support as you meditate deeply through conscious connected breathwork. Her presence is gentle and supportive, guiding you to self-knowledge, empowerment, and deep healing.

www.ResonanceVashon.com

Mentioned in this episode (and related links)

• “What Is Breathwork?” (via the Cleveland Clinic)

• A style of breathwork called Transformational Breathing

• Radical Acceptance as described in Dialectical Behavior Therapy

• Article discussing how animals release energy after truama

• The Grieving Body (interview with author Dr. Mary-Frances O’Connor)

• Research on the power of sound to heal

• Exploring anger and grief

• The 5 Stages of Death by Elizabeth Kubler-Ross, which was later formed into the concept of “5 Stages of Grief” (which are definitely not linear!)

Other Breathing Wind episodes related to somatic practices and processing emotions:

• The Body is Everything

• What Feels Safe

• Trauma, Grief, and Emotions

  ---

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Ken and I were brainstorming ideas for possible podcast guests, and searching for a common theme among our suggestions. What jumped out at me was that each proposed guest offered a different way of engaging with grief—through song, visual art, talk therapy, or somatic practices. To me, each person’s unique strategy represented a door to grief. Perhaps through conversation, we could unlock those doors together and glimpse their inner world more fully.

"Doors To Grief, Ep. 1: Asteroid City"

This first episode was a detour from the typical Breathing Wind guest list, in that the interviewee Andrew Clinnin, is not specifically working in a grief space. That being said, I did meet Andrew in a grief-centric way, through a website called The Dinner Party. In the site’s own words:

The Dinner Party is a platform for grieving 21-45-year-olds to find community, peer-led support, and build lasting relationships. Since 2018, The Dinner Party has connected more than 13,000 grieving peers to one another. We screen, train and support a growing network of peer Hosts, and connect them to 10-15 other grievers to form Tables.

Although some meetups are in-person (actual potluck-style dinner parties!) my group happens to be virtual. Andrew hosts our “table” for younger folks who have experienced partner loss and we meet up over Zoom to chat.

There isn’t usually a set topic; rather, we just let the conversation take us wherever it wants to go, based on how everyone’s week has been unfolding. One time this meant a fairly in-depth ranking of types of apples (I’m a proponent of Cosmic Crisp). Other times, it means discussing how to sort through your partner’s belongings, the tribulations of dating, or how to navigate meeting new co-workers. We also keep in touch via WhatsApp and have a shared calendar with wedding anniversaries and death dates, so that we know when to send some extra support to one another.

Andrew’s love for the movie Asteroid City became clear over time. He even has an Asteroid City shirt that makes an occasional appearance! As a group, we often discuss movies and TV shows that explore grief or young partner loss, but Asteroid City intrigued me because the widower’s grief isn’t the film’s central focus. Instead, it’s woven into a story full of whimsy, absurdity, and thoughtful subplots. I wondered: What makes this movie speak so deeply to Andrew’s loss? Are there more doors to grief like this one, hiding in plain sight? This felt like an interesting initial door to open.

So, here we are: Episode 1 of the miniseries! It’s been out for a little over a week, and some listeners have been inspired to watch (or rewatch) Asteroid City. I invite you to reflect on what movies, shows, and songs have validated your grief (and feel free to share them in the comments or via email)! Furthermore, I hope this episode invites some non-grievers to step into this space out of curiosity—after all, we will all be grievers one day if we aren’t already.

Here’s a clip from Asteroid City featuring two scenes that we discussed during the episode—one where the main character storms off the set and is advised to “keep telling the story” despite his confusion about the plot, and another where he meets the actress who was supposed to play his wife.

I deeply appreciated Andrew Clinnin’s candor and poignant observations. I was especially moved by his story about his wife Ellen’s experience as a standardized patient. I love how this movie has given Andrew a way to connect with his grief through a medium that was near and dear to Ellen—who was a talented stage actor, playwright, and, of course, a Wes Anderson fan.

Thank you for being here. I can’t wait to share Episode 2 with you this Tuesday, February 25th, which is a conversation about breathwork with Erin Collins!

Sending hugs from my home near Seattle (and from Asteroid City, USA),

Julia

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“In this movie you've got this guy who's, by all accounts, trying really hard to just keep everything together...That ends up being a much more potent thing for communicating this message than something that's more directly trying to address grief.”

- Andrew Clinnin

Hi, Julia Mark here. I'm honored to share the first installment of my Breathing Wind miniseries called “Doors to Grief.” In this episode, I talk with Andrew Clinnin about how Asteroid City—a visually playful Wes Anderson film—became an unexpected lens for understanding his experience as a young widower.

I know today’s guest, Andrew Clinnin through the online grief group he formed via The Dinner Party. Andrew he has created a wonderful space for people in their 20s and 30s who have experienced partner loss. It was a privilege to learn more about his unique journey.

Whether you’ve seen the film or not, this episode offers a fresh perspective on how stories—both on-screen and in our own lives—shape the way we grieve and grow.

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About Andrew Clinnin:

Andrew Clinnin lives in San Francisco, trying to survive outside his natural midwestern habitat. He’s most often spotted mumbling to himself behind his work computer, camera, or sewing machine. Andrew’s wife Ellen was a stage actor and playwright who died in 2022 after two COVID-cursed years with gastric cancer. But she doesn’t want us to remember her by that last bit.

Mentioned in this episode:

• Asteroid City

• Sarah’s conversation with the co-founder of The Dinner Party, Lennon Flowers on Apple Podcasts and Spotify (Season 1, Episode 13)

• doesthedogdie.com: a database of categorized content warnings for movies, television shows, books, video games and more!

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“We need to stay open to this very natural response to how we experience the big losses changes in our lives. And if we can do that — it doesn’t come at once, it doesn’t come in big ahas — but there there is transformation, and there’s healing and wisdom and creative inspiration and new perspectives. There’s so much that we have access to that we may never be moved by or never encounter if we avoid or shut down our grief.”

~ Naila Francis

In this episode, we (Sarah and Naila) sit down for our last conversation together as Breathing Wind transitions to a new chapter — which includes our appearance here on Substack, where you will find the podcast from now on.

From the podcast’s beginning with Sarah’s personal journey grieving the death of her dad to its growth during the pandemic, Sarah’s introduction to Naila, which ultimately led to her serving as co-host, and the show’s evolution from its focus primarily on parent loss to encompass more expansive experiences of grief, we reflect on coming to this moment of change.

After years of being a caregiver to her mom, Dr. Sandra Davis, while she suffered with Alzheimer’s disease, Sarah said goodbye to her in October of last year, not long after we recorded this episode. Her grief over that death surfaces in this episode, as has been our practice of making space for what’s on each other’s hearts in our conversations.

We also share what it was like to work together, what our plans are moving forward and our appreciation for this time with all of you who joined us here, whether as guests, newcomers or longtime listeners.

Breathing Wind has been such a remarkable space for both of us. The guests we’ve been so fortunate to interview — you’ll hear from several of them in this episode including co-founder of The Dinner Party Lennon Flowers, poet Rosemerry Wahtola Trommer, and jazz vocalist, composer and playwright Nnenna Freelon — gifted us so much wisdom, encouragement and affirmation from their stories of grief and loss. We also look back on some special moments such as our virtual launch party to kick off Naila joining the podcast, sharing a powerful grief practice offered by Rev. Rhetta Morgan and a moving performance by singer-songwriter-pianist Julia Mark.

And speaking of Julia…it is such a joy to announce that while she may not be the podcast’s permanent new host, she will be taking over this project for us and already has some great ideas of her own moving forward. Julia brings her own experience with grief to the show, having lost her beloved husband, musician Bredon Jones, to cancer in early 2023. And we are so honored that she agreed to carry on, for however long she chooses, to nurture, as she put it, “this open arena to sit with grief.”

Julia joins us for this conversation to share some of her own thoughts about grief, ask us for our most helpful tips in hosting the podcast and also hints at what’s coming next, including her exploration of the intersection of art and grief. We hope you’ll welcome her with all the warmth and generosity you shared with us.

And if you’d like to keep up with us, you can follow both of us on Substack — Sarah at Warmly, Iowa and Naila at The Griefness — and Naila is also on Instagram.

Want to share your thoughts on this episode? We’d love to hear from you in the comments below.

Leave a comment

Show notes

Mentioned in this episode:

Episode 2: Never Alone with Benjamin Gunning

Episode 13: The Space to Be Messy with Lennon Flowers

Naila’s first appearance on the podcast, interviewed by Deborah Szeto

Episode 77: Honoring the Full Range of Grief with Rosemerry Wahtola Trommer

Episode 82: Surfer Dan Fischer is Shaping an Active Grief Memorial through One Last Wave Project

Episode 84: Love is the Mother of Grief with Nnenna Freelon

Episode 68: The Possibility of Pleasure with Oceana Sawyer

Season 2 Trailer: What is Healing?

Season 3 Trailer: What is Joy?

Throwing the Bones with Dr. JoAnne Dodgson

Listen here

This Newsletter

You’ve made it to this list because you’ve collaborated with us on Breathing Wind or supported it, attended a Breathing Wind event Sarah and Naila held, you’re a close friend, you’ve followed us on social media, you are a past guest, or you’ve signed up directly on the form on our former website. If you don’t want to receive these newsletters, please feel free to unsubscribe.

Subscribe now

~ Naila Francis

In this farewell episode, Sarah and Naila revisit the emotionally rich journey of their podcast, celebrating the support and community that has been built. They share poignant clips from past episodes, including conversations with guests like Benjamin Gunning, Lennon Flowers, and Naila Francis, reflecting on themes of grief, resilience, and creativity. As they pass the torch to new potential host Julia Mark, they discuss their future creative endeavors and express deep gratitude to their listeners. The episode emphasizes the importance of allowing grief to be a shared, evolving conversation.

Show notes

Mentioned in this episode:

Episode 2: Never Alone with Benjamin Gunning

Episode 13: The Space to Be Messy with Lennon Flowers

Naila’s first appearance on the podcast, interviewed by Deborah Szeto

Episode 77: Honoring the Full Range of Grief with Rosemerry Wahtola Trommer

Episode 82: Surfer Dan Fischer is Shaping an Active Grief Memorial through One Last Wave Project

Episode 84: Love is the Mother of Grief with Nnenna Freelon

Episode 68: The Possibility of Pleasure with Oceana Sawyer

Season 2 Trailer: What is Healing?

Season 3 Trailer: What is Joy?

Throwing the Bones with Dr. JoAnne Dodgson

Subscribe now

The podcast

Breathing Wind is about grief and loss and how we journey with these lifelong companions. We offer warm, honest and insightful conversations for the introspective at heart. Launched in 2019 as a personal grief project, the podcast struck a chord with listeners looking for a space to feel less alone in their grief. Quickly, a dedicated community grew around the candid and compelling conversations with others who knew grief just as intimately and those who offered guidance for navigating this universal human experience.

Meet the host

Julia Mark is a singer-songwriter, pianist, and educator originally from the Northeastern US. Since releasing her album Keeping You in 2019, her work has revolved around grief and gratitude, particularly following her husband's death from a rare cancer in 2023. Julia is currently based in the Seattle area.

Past hosts

Sarah Davis founded Breathing Wind.

When her dad passed away, she hiked part of the Camino de Santiago to honor him and spread his ashes. It was there that she learned the power of her voice, community and grief story sharing – and then wanted to share that with others.

By day, she works as an instructional designer in Des Moines, IA and hosts Warmly, Iowa, a podcast about Iowa and home.

You can find Sarah’s latest work at warmlyia.substack.com.

Naila Francis is a writer, grief coach, death midwife and ordained interfaith minister — and a co-host of Breathing Wind. Her dad died of esophageal cancer in 2012, the year after a beloved father figured died of pancreatic cancer. Those losses eventually led to her vocation holding space for the grieving and dying.

Through her practice This Hallowed Wilderness and her work as an officiant, Naila offers coaching, ritual and ceremony for people at many of life's sacred thresholds, including birth, marriage and death. Whether she’s one-on-one with a client or offering a workshop or other group event, she brings a love of poetry, nature and community to her work.

Naila is also a founding member of Salt Trails, a Philadelphia collective making grief public and visible through community rituals, and a Pachakuti Mesa carrier in the Indigenous Andean tradition.

Her life thus far has been one of many hats since her first job after college was as a police reporter for a local newspaper. She later went on to interview dozens of artists and entertainers as a features writer, including Pink, kd lang, Brandi Carlile and James Earl Jones.

When she’s not grief-tending or creating ritual space, you can often find her steeped in wonder (and maybe singing) in her favorite cathedral, the woods; savoring a new chocolate mug cake recipe; writing poems; and dreaming of her favorite grief allies, the grey whales she once kissed in Baja, Mexico.

Oceana Sawyer is an End of Life Doula focused on the liminal space of active dying and grief. She is currently researching and holding space in the realm of embodied grieving in a context of somatic abolitionism. Drawing upon her meditation practices, experience as a sensuality educator, earth-based spirituality, and an intensive study in the expressive arts and integral counseling psychology, she brings a grounded, compassionate presence to her work with individuals and groups. You can follow her on her website and participate in her online grief community on Patreon.

Dara Kosberg is the Program Director at the nonprofit, Reimagine, a community channeling the hardest parts of life, including loss and adversity, into meaningful action and growth. Her interest in working in the end of life and grief space was inspired by the loss of her mom at a young age and the isolation she felt from the experience. Through her work at Reimagine, she's been able to combine a number of her passions including stand-up comedy. She's produced and performed in a number of comedy shows focused on grief and loss, and brings this to her role as host this season.

Duncan Cheung is a wilderness explorer and adventure guide with over 15,000 miles of on-trail and off-trail wilderness experience. Guiding and teaching is a part of how Duncan approaches his North Star, which for the last decade has remained largely unchanged: Cultivate fulfillment with and for all beings.

Through Off Trail On Track, a nonprofit that he founded and leads, he creates learning experiences in the wilderness to enable people to disconnect with what doesn't matter and reconnect with what does: themselves, one another, and the wild. Duncan has learned that the exploration of the outer wilderness is an invitation to explore each of our inner wildernesses, which he helps leaders and executives explore through his coaching practice.

Duncan is also a seasoned business executive, facilitator, public speaker, and strategy advisor to Boards of Directors and executive teams from startups to Fortune 500 companies.

Duncan has three homes: Hong Kong, where he grew up, Berkeley, where he lives, and Wilderness, where he belongs. When he’s not in the wilderness, Duncan loves to take Kiyo, his 9-year-old ninja-geologist son, mining and camping.

Deborah Szeto is an ICU and palliative care nurse for a hospital in the Bay Area.

Ken Breniman is an Oakland, CA-based Licensed Clinical Social Worker, Certified Yoga Therapist with a passion for nudging the Western mental health paradigm in regards to safe, legal and ethical integration of sacred plant medicines or psychedelics. With a thanatological (study of mortality) approach to holding space for others, Ken has a deep reverence for Spirit while acknowledging each of us must find our own way of making sense of the experience of being human. Combining the essence of Kierkegaard's "Live life forward, understand it backwards" with Ram Dass' "We are all walking each other home" provides a hint at how Ken is attempting to understand his own being human.

Wendy is a grief counselor whose background is in birth and death doula work. She is particularly awed by grief's ability to transform and expand our lives. A long-time supporter of those in transition, Wendy brings a calm and loving presence to any situation. She believes fervently in the healing power of meditation, being in nature, yoga, music, storytelling and laughter, and is always looking for ways to incorporate these elements into her healing practice. Wendy works with ideas from Buddhist philosophy and parts therapy to help clients grow their compassion and self-awareness.

Wendy received her training with the International End of Life Doula Association and her MS in Counseling Psychology from California State University East Bay. She has three kids, three dogs, three cats and loves gardening, reading, singing and knitting.

“I've been very present to the fact that there have been these huge, huge joys. But every time I meet a huge joy, it just drops me deeper into the grief, which is part of what I always say about grief.

The more you open yourself to the joy, the more you open yourself to the grief and vice versa. So that kind of feels like where my journey has been this summer.”

~ Naila Francis

In this episode, inspired by our conversation with grief activist, author and podcast host Lisa Keefauver, we reflect on where our journeys have taken us these last few months, including the grief we’re both living with. As we invite you into these personal experiences, we share the ways grief continues to surprise and teach us — and how challenging it can be to lean into those lessons that come ‘round again and again. Given all the wisdom Lisa shared with us from her new book, “Grief is A Sneaky Bitch” (also the title of her podcast) in the previous episode, we also explore some of the threads that most resonated with us, especially the value of seeking support, which can be tricky to do when you’re the one often giving it. We’re so grateful for Lisa’s work challenging conventional narratives around grief. And we invite you to consider the narratives you hold around loss, how they might be impacting you and how you care for yourself and others in times of grief. 

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Mentioned in this episode:

• Creating a new narrative for grief (our previous episode with Lisa Keefauver)

• Lisa Keefauver

• Salt Trails

• Good Grief

• Faith Matters Network

• Pauline Boss’ theory of ambiguous loss

• Elisabeth Kübler-Ross’ 5 Stages of Grief

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“So if our narrative understood that it's emotional and cognitive and physical and spiritual and relational, how might we attend to ourselves differently?  How might we attend to other people in our lives differently? How, if we believed it as a culture, would we institute policies and systems that attended to grief differently?”

- Lisa Keefauver

In this episode, we talk with Lisa Keefauver, grief activist, author and podcast host of “Grief is a Sneaky Bitch,” about grief as a multidimensional experience that encompasses more than death and more than our emotions. With compelling insight, compassionate warmth, the truth of her own lived experience and her background as a narrative therapist, Lisa shines a light on some of the stories, beliefs and habits that cause us more suffering as we grieve — while also offering tips and suggestions to help soften grief’s hard edges. She talks about the vulnerability and bravery of inviting in support and candidly shares her own struggles with receiving care. In fact, Lisa is nothing but candid throughout this entire episode, as she reflects on grieving and being grateful for her late husband Eric, her journey with breast cancer and what grief has taught her about living a fuller, richer life. You’ll probably want to listen with a journal or come back to this episode again, as, with fall right  around the corner, it feels like a timely roadmap to help us all navigate this human experience with more grace for ourselves. 

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About Lisa

Lisa Keefauver is a grief activist. Her wisdom on the topic of grief and loss are rooted in the decades she spent as a social worker, narrative therapist, non-profit co-founder, clinical supervisor and more. Her insights on grief are also embodied from personal losses, including the death of her husband when she was just 40 years old. Lisa's grief advocacy has inspired her to create and host the top-rated podcast, Grief is a Sneaky Bitch; serve as an adjunct professor of Loss and Grief at the University of Texas at Austin; act as an organizational consultant to facilitate grief-smart organizations; write/appear as a thought leader across media platforms and as a keynote speaker. Just after receiving a Breast Cancer diagnosis in 2023, she delivered her now popular TEDx Talk, Why Knowing More About Grief Can Make it Suck Less. You can order her highly acclaimed book, Grief Is A Sneaky Bitch: An Uncensored Guide to Navigating Loss now. Get free grief support and resources by signing up for her Not-So-Regular Newsletter at www.lisakeefauver.com. Follow on socials @lisakeefauvermsw - Instagram LinkedIn YouTube Facebook.

Mentioned in this episode:

• www.lisakeefauver.com

• Socials @lisakeefauvermsw - Instagram LinkedIn YouTube Facebook

• Lisa’s Ted Talk

• Lisa’s Media Maker feature about grief

• Grief is a Sneaky Bitch podcast

• “Grief is a Sneaky Bitch: An Uncensored Guide to Navigating Loss,” the book

• Elisabeth Kübler-Ross’ 5 Stages of Grief

• “The Grieving Brain” by Mary-Frances O’Connor

• Pauline Boss’ theory of ambiguous loss

• Brené Brown’s 87 emotions

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Connect with us on social media: Instagram

“As a death midwife, one of the things many of us do is work on legacy projects with people who are dying and their loved ones, and yet sometimes I think it's really not up to us to know what our legacy is. I can hope it will be this particular thing, but at the end of the day, the people we leave behind are the ones really making the meaning and interpreting our lives for us.”

~Naila Francis

Welcome to our celebratory 100th episode of the Breathing Wind Podcast, where we reflect on some of the recurring themes around grief that have shaped the podcast since it began. We revisit key moments in conversations with a handful of guests that touch on navigating life transitions with openness, the intersection of grief and joy and what it means to leave behind a legacy. As we share from our own grief journeys, we note how challenging it can be to embody emotional self-awareness, the surprising parts of ourselves that show up in the midst of profound change, and whether it’s truly possible to know the impact we leave behind. We do know, however, that this podcast has created a virtual community, and we remain grateful for you, listeners, as well as the growth we’ve experienced, and the future of our shared journey.

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Mentioned in this episode:

• A Feeling of Completeness with Wendy Rolon (Season 1)

• The Willingness to be Open, with Dara Kosberg and Vinny Ferraro (Season 3)

• Growing a New Heart with Nnenna Freelon (Season 4)

• Living and Dying with Love and Compassion with Susan J. Tweit (Season 4)

• Rolling Out the Welcome Mat for Grief with Mara June (Season 5)

• What’s Your Grief?

• Steven Jenkinson, author of Die Wise

• Ken Breniman, past guest and guest host (Seasons 1-2)

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Connect with us on social media: Instagram

“I think some of the clearest decisions I've ever made have come in the aftermath of grief.” ~Naila Francis

In this episode, we look back on our enchanting and insightful conversation with Mara June, an educator, facilitator, community weaver, writer, caregiver, death doula and community herbalist. Reflecting on her deep belief in the creative energy inherent in grieving, we discuss grief’s transformative power in our lives and some of the ways we’ve been creatively called to change how we show up in the world. For Sarah, that included re-evaluating her career and the work she was doing, and for Naila, transformation came in waves affecting many areas of her life. As we’ve done across several episodes, we circle back to the presence of joy as part of grief and in particular how grief opens us up to feel more alive by giving us access to the full range of our emotions. We also acknowledge, with gratitude to Mara for naming this, numbness as part of grieving, and explore the idea of bringing tenderness and beauty to death, even in challenging circumstances, as Naila was able to do at her dad’s deathbed, and as Sarah has continued to do by nurturing a connection that was meaningful to her own father. We hope this conversation invites you to make a little more room for your grief and to be gentle with all the changes your journey may be calling you to. As always, we’d love to hear what moved or resonated with you, and we thank you for allowing us to be companions on your journey.

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Mentioned in this episode:

Mara June:

Social media

Website

A Welcome Space for Grief: Mara June’s Breathing Wind episode

Episode 10: Comfort in the Written Word (Breathing Wind episode about bibliotherapist’s approach)

Zen Caregiving Project (formerly Zen Hospice Center)

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"In allowing ourselves to feel our grief, or to feel present with whatever is coming up for us — not excluding our joy —  that's actually helping us to feel more deeply in all of these areas in our life. And I think that is part of the enchantment piece for me...When we feel more deeply, then we can also feel enchantment and wonder and awe and all of these other things as well."

~ Mara June

In this episode, death doula, community herbalist, educator and writer Mara June invites us to consider the ways grief calls us to change who we are and how we move in the world. Framing this “undoing” as liberating, they share grief’s potential to make us magicians, opening us up to mystery and wonder and bringing us more alive. We also talk about their own journey with grief and loss, how they came to community death care, and how we can bring moments of beauty and tenderness to the end of life. Noting that we have never grieved alone, Mara speaks to the wise and nourishing role of plants in tending our grief, introducing us to some of their favorites. (Hint: if you’re not into chamomile, you will be after listening!). And of course, we couldn’t leave this conversation without talking about their spells and their deeply affirming memes and social media posts, which you’ll definitely want to check out for yourself. We learned so much in this conversation and also shared some sweet moments with Mara when they turned the mic on us. May it inspire you, too, on your shapeshifting journey through grief. 

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About Mara June

Mara June is an educator, facilitator, community weaver, writer, caregiver, death doula, and community herbalist. They're excited about plant magic, story-telling, art making, shapeshifting, and dreaming together. Their death and grief care work takes place in group settings in hopes of helping to weave deeply attuned and resourced communities who love, care, dream, and create courageously in times of change and grief.

Mentioned in this episode:

Mara June:

Social media

Website

The magician in tarot

“Joyful Militancy” book

Russian sage

Chamomile

Bayo Akomolafe

Francis Weller

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Mentioned in this episode:

Ahlay Blakeley:

• Patreon

• Bandcamp

• Website

• Instagram

Land Alliance Folk School and Retreat Center

Liz Rog

Salt Trails

To the woman I saw today who wept in her car by Bianca Lynne Spriggs

All There Is with Anderson Cooper

Good Grief (Trailer)

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“I believe that community singing, which I define as, when a group of folks come together and they sing songs together that are easy enough lyrically and easy enough melodically to be taught in the moment. And then we sing these songs, which I personally call spells or prayers together that are amplified and help put us in some sort of altered state through the process of singing these songs, it's a technology for  belonging. It's a technology for metabolizing grief.”

~ Alexandra Blakely (AKA ahlay)

From the moment she dropped into our opening invitation to a deep breath, with an admitted mix of tension in her body and openness in her heart,  artist, singer-songwriter, communal grief tender and community organizer Alexandra "Ahlay" Blakely took us on an unforgettable journey. In this profound and inspiring conversation, we touch on the nuances and complexities of navigating this tumultuous time in the world and how songs can help us move our grief through our bodies in a way the mind can’t and doesn’t have to understand. In reframing communal singing as our inherent birthright, she speaks to the shame many of us have around our singing voices, shares the sense of belonging found in song circles and how songs can be spells casting an impact far beyond immediate time and place. In sharing her journey from backup pop singer to activist to ritual and community song circle facilitator, Ahlay proves a compelling storyteller — you won’t want to miss the dream she shares about whales, among so many other moments in this episode, including when she and Naila discover their profound affinity for whales has more in common than they could have imagined. 

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About Alexandra Blakely

ahlay (alexandra blakely) is a dreamer of Whale, Tsunami, and Rain, an apprentice to Lightning and Fire, an artist, singer-songwriter, community organizer and soul guide in training. She is a descendent of Ashkenazi, Scandinavian and British folk and a commitment to breaking the cycles of intergenerational trauma both caused and endured by her ancestors. This commitment unfolds through the mediums of authentic relationship, song and storytelling, ritual and spell casting in ways that acknowledge our varied and intricate histories and identities, emphasizing a devotion to remembering our symbiotic relationship within the natural world.

ahlay has been deeply involved in community activism, communal grief tending and community singing. She is a lifelong student of decolonization, anti-racism and her own ancestral deracination preceeding diasporas. She gets curious about how the individual psyche, embodiment, shadow and trauma responses can be applied to collective and cultural bodies. She has trained with generative somatics, Education for Racial Equity, Animas Valley Institute, The Work that Reconnects, Holistic Resistance, Francis Weller and Laurence Cole. Her community singing albums encapsulate songs for the community to transform, ask questions, and seek to lead lives in service to the future ones. Her upcoming 2024 community singing album, WAILS: Songs for Grief was recorded in July 2023 with a choir of 200 voices.
To stay informed about her ongoing offerings, sign up for her monthly newsletter.

Featured Songs:

Spell

written and sung by alexandra blakely

co-produced and mixed by Michael Linder

mastered by Todd Boston

Find the following songs on Bandcamp:

https://ahlayblakely.bandcamp.com/

• Grief Mother

• Surrender

• Carry this All

Mentioned in this episode:

Ahlay Blakely:

• Patreon

• Bandcamp

• Website

• Instagram

Alejandro Jodorowsky

Francis Weller

Masaru Emoto

Salt Trails

Bruce Lee Quote

Deep Time by Joanna Macy

More on whales:

• https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/study-suggests-dolphins-and-some-whales-grieve-their-dead-180969414/

• https://www.uniguide.com/whale-meaning-symbolism-spirit-animal

• https://atmos.earth/overview-whales-gods-among-us/

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“When I was on the Camino, there was this moment when I was spreading [my dad’s] ashes and just talking to him and I realized that was why I was there,  that he wanted me there. And I felt so connected to him, and at that time I remember thinking, ‘This is so simple. I can turn off everything and go out for a walk in the woods and be connected with my dad.’”

~ Sarah Davis

In this episode, recorded during the holiday season, we debrief our Christmases: how we spent them, how our grief showed up and how we coped, or didn’t. Reflecting on our conversation with author and plant ecologist Susan Tweit, who still finds so many beautiful ways to be with her late husband Richard, we recall instances of connection with our own dads — and in a very candid moment, reveal some of the moments along our fathers’ end-of-life journeys, exploring some of our regrets and our denial. Again drawing from Susan’s wisdom and devoted mindfulness practice, we also look at the role of love and compassion in our lives, and Sarah shares an especially helpful technique that helps her to meet her mom from that place when she gets overwhelmed or starts to feel intense emotion around her caregiving. Perhaps not surprising, there’s some meandering, as we also talk about aging, the healthcare system and our wishes for more collective and communal death care. But mostly there’s a lot of heart and tender honesty in this episode. We hope you’ll bring your heart to listening and invite you, as always, to share what resonated or what you’ll be carrying forward into your own grief journey. 

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Mentioned in this episode:

• Susan J Tweit’s Website

• Bless the Birds: Living with Love in a Time of Dying by Susan J. Tweit

• Breathing Wind Episode 32: Water in Her Eyes, a conversation with Ken Breniman and Madeleine Bachan Kaur

  UNDERSTANDING THE HUCHA-SAMI CONTINUUM By Sheila Guarnagia

• Zen Caregiving Project

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“If we have the intention to live with love and compassion, we can handle anything. We are amazing beings, we humans. We can also really screw up badly, but if we have the intention to live with love and compassion, it changes what we do and how we are.”

~ Susan J. Tweit

In her memoir, Bless the Birds: Living with Love in a Time of Dying, Susan J. Tweit, an award-winning writer and plant ecologist, recounts her journey accompanying her husband toward the end of his life, following a diagnosis with brain cancer. We explore what it was like for her to navigate those devastatingly bittersweet last two years of his life, which included a 4,000-mile honeymoon road trip they’d long put off and the death of Susan’s mom to Alzheimer’s. But as Susan shares her experiences of grief and death with us, what shines through is not so much the challenges and pain of her journey — though she is candid about both, especially having been a caregiver — but her insistence on fully living during those years. She and her husband Richard were committed to filling their days with love, compassion, beauty, wonder and gratitude for each other. As she speaks to life after Richard, Susan reflects on how she still carries him with her, what it’s been like to reclaim her independence and what we can all learn from facing death with less fear.

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About Susan J. Tweit:

An award-winning writer and plant ecologist, Susan J. Tweit began her career in Wyoming, studying grizzly bear habitat—collecting and dissecting large piles of bear poop—coring trees to map historic wildfires, and researching big sagebrush. Tweit began writing after realizing that she loved writing the stories behind the data as much as collecting the data. Her beat is interpreting the community of the land, and what those interwoven lives have to teach we humans. Tweit has written thirteen non-fiction books, including the new memoir, Bless the Birds, winner of the Sarton Award, along with hundreds of magazine articles, columns, and essays. Her “WildLives” nature commentaries were a popular weekly feature on public radio for over a decade. She admits to being a plant nerd focused on the intriguing lives and interrelationships of our indigenous flora, and a consummate "reader" of landscapes. Her passion is re-storying this earth, and we who share the planet. When Tweit is not writing, she's most often outside eradicating invasive weeds—restoring nature, plant by plant. As a Quaker, she walks her talk, and she searches for stories in the Rocky Mountain region, wherever big sagebrush perfumes the air.

Mentioned in this episode:

• Susan J Tweit’s Website

• Bless the Birds: Living with Love in a Time of Dying by Susan J. Tweit

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“Our Christmas lights now are all blue since Ron left. I want to honor the day and the spirit of it, but the bright, shining twinkle lights and jingle bells don't speak to my heart. When the blue lights are turned on, the room is bathed with a lovely blue, which creates exactly the right atmosphere to sink into the holy yet joyful season.”

~Marge Sexton

In this holiday compilation episode, we offer a glimpse of others’ experiences of the holidays after loss. Sarah shares her journey with grief during the holiday season, including embracing new traditions. Naila shares a poem she wrote about blue Christmas lights and the beauty of grief. Three listeners — Marge Sexton, Righteous Jolly, and Roseanne Corcoran — also share their unique experiences of processing grief over the holidays and their coping mechanisms, including celebrating the memory of loved ones, channeling emotions through art, and connecting with nature. Last, but not least, writer and plant biologist Susan Tweit shares a glimpse of how she processes her grief (and hint, it’s a preview of our upcoming episode :)). 

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"If you're willing to open to the journey and if you're willing to really allow yourself to feel your grief and have practices to engage it, it does shape-shift over time. It does become softer. It does become something that you can carry maybe with a little more...lightness and grace."

~Naila Francis

In this episode, we delve into varied facets of grief and loss, including the transformative potential that grief holds. Reflecting on our conversation with poet, dream yogi and grief guide, Ning Tendo, from the last episode, we explore our own relationship with dreams and dreaming and some of the images that have both troubled and soothed us in our grief. Given Ning’s intentionality caring for her broken heart after the death of her mom, we share the containers that have helped us make room for our grief, as well as the practices that deepen care and compassion for ourselves. (Jacuzzi time and flower arranging, anyone?) We also touch upon an often-avoided subject in grief — anger —  as we share our unique perceptions, challenges and strategies for navigating all that grief, an ever-unpredictable guest, invites. Sarah vulnerably shares what’s been shifting in her journey both as a caregiver to her mom and a grieving daughter while we both underline the importance of allowing ourselves to experience grief fully in order for healing and transformation to take place.

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Mentioned in this episode:

• Dreaming into Grief and Love (Breathing Wind Episode 91) with Ning Tendo

• Ning Tendo’s website

• @ning_tendo (Instagram)

• Shamanic drumming (Insight Timer article)

• Love is the Mother of Grief (Breathing Wind Episode 84) with Nnenna Freelon

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“Just having that dream visit, even just one visit, can nourish somebody and really give them the courage to go into their grief because it's not enough to have those dreams. It doesn't negate the pain of their physical absence. You still need to do the hard work. You still need to go into your grief and really unwind all of those stories and all of the different things that are present, but being able to connect with them in that way nourishes you. You don't feel so hopeless anymore.” 

~ Ning Tendo

In this week’s episode, we speak with guest Ning Tendo, a published poet, spiritual healer, dream yogi, and grief guide. Ning shares her profound insights into the transformative power of grief and how it can reveal unexplored aspects of ourselves. She discusses her unique approach to navigating grief through exploring dreams, offering practical advice on how to connect with the essence of lost loved ones. Ning also shares her rich cultural background and traditions around grief from Cameroon and contrasts them with her experiences in America. Overall, Ning provides a fresh perspective on embracing grief as a pathway to personal growth, self-awareness, and an expanded understanding of life relationships.

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About Ning Tendo:

Ning is a published poet, grief guide, spiritual healer and dream yogi specializing in the intersection of the healing power of dreams, rituals, and spiritual constellations as potent tools for helping the bereaved evolve and continue their relationship with their dead loved one, learn how to grieve in a new way, and launch into a new and more expansive phase of their life that is full of purpose, creativity, and their unique contribution to the world.

Mentioned in this episode:

• Ning Tendo’s website

• @ning_tendo (Instagram)

• Ning’s book, Death Song in Green Poems

• Salt Trails Community Grief Processional

• Joanna Macy quote

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